Episode 3: Nik Patel, Trader & Autor

Making Money in Crypto by Speculating on Altcoins

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If you google about “trading altcoins” the top result you will find is Nik Patel and his “Altcoin Trader’s Handbook”, an extremely practical and at the same time entertaining guide on how to analyze, trade, and profit from altcoins. Half-way through reading Nik’s book, I knew I wanted to interview him. He has seen it all – from generating 43X returns to losing all of his capital. In this talk, we cover:

  1. Dogecoin, which initially got Nik into crypto. We analyze why the Dogecoin still exists, and why it will continue to exist even without the recent promotion it received from Elon Musk.
  2. We then move to discuss how one can trade altcoins in a profitable way as a side hustle alongside your day job or how you can make altcoin trading your full-time job.
  3. Nik makes an in-depth analysis of the price of bitcoin and altcoins, the dependencies between those and his price action expectations.
  4. Last but not least, Nik shares his rationale as to why even the world’s wealthiest cannot destroy bitcoin.

This conversation was truly intriguing for me, which is why this episode ended up being a little longer than ones I previously did. But trust me, every minute of listening is totally worth it.

Nik’s Contact:

Evangelists who converted Nik into crypto:

Leaders Nik continues to learn from:

Other resources mentioned in the podcast:

 Feel free to message me, George, on Twitter @borderlessBTC.

Full Episode Transcript

(02:13) George Manolov:

Nik, it’s great to have you here on the show. I recently read your book, about, trading altcoins and midway through the book I was like, I definitely have to talk to Nik. He has а lot to share with our audience. He has a lot of very valuable insights that are worth to be spread around more and I’m happy to have you here. So just as a general intro – you have a very substantial following on Twitter, you have a book, you have a newsletter where you’re sharing a lot of insights. But for those of our listeners who don’t know or who haven’t heard of you, can you share who is Nik Patel?

(03:04) Nik Patel:

Sure. So, I’m most commonly known probably by my Twitter handle, which is @cointradernik. I’ve been full time speculating in the cryptocurrency space for about three years now, but I’ve been involved in thе space for about five and a half years. Do you want me to go into the full backstory of how I came across these things?

(03:33) George Manolov:

That would be actually great because when I read your book, and when I was thinking before the talk about the ways in which different people come across crypto, I realized your story was truly unique. So if you can just brief us how did it start and how did it develop from there?

(03:58) Nik Patel:

Sure. So, I had no idea what bitcoin was, no idea what cryptocurrencies were, and this is in November to December, 2013. I also had no idea what Reddit was and I never really used it, but somehow during my Christmas holidays, whilst I was still at college in 2013, I stumbled upon a subreddit for a cryptocurrency called Dogecoin. And you know, I had absolutely no idea what any of this stuff was. It just seemed very strange at first. There was an entire community of people devoted to what was basically just throwing around memes about a dog. And I didn’t know that there was actually any underlying technology for this. But I got kind of captivated by just the general sense of community on this subreddit, and just fell down the rabbit hole from there. Back then they used to have tipping tools everywhere for Dogecoin. And within that subreddit, you could ask a question and people would tip you Doge. So my first interaction with cryptocurrencies was actually being tipped like 100,000 Doge. And I was like, wow, this is weird. That’s like one fifth of a cent at the time. And yeah, so then from there you get the Doge tip to you and then you download the wallets and you start to get some sort of familiarity with it. And then it kind of just spiraled from there. I started thinking more and more about it and getting more and more interested. I came across the next coin, which was Vertcoin, which was being launched, around the start of 2014. And at this point I still had no idea what bitcoin was. I didn’t know that there was actually an original cryptocurrency that sparked all of these being made. And it wasn’t until end of February, when I started doing some more research into the technology that I actually realized, right – so there’s bitcoin and then there’s altcoins which are being created on mass. And then in March, 2014 I created a Twitter account and joined a group of probably around maybe 15,000 people on crypto Twitter at the time. And all of the usual suspects who are still quite prominent today were around then and helped me basically become part of the community from that point.

(06:35) George Manolov:

Okay. And before you tell us more about your particular journey, please allow me to take some time and just ask you a little more about this Dogecoin. I mean, this is still very fascinating to me. I entered the crypto space later than you. It wasn’t until 2017 and the boom, and I’ve come across the Doge several times as well. And as I was looking at your book, and today, before the call, I looked at Doge again because before, when people always mentioned it, I was like, you know, this is a joke. This is the biggest joke in crypto. I have no clue why it exists. And even today when I went onto the website they have this super ridiculous video of the dog just flying around. And unlike any other altcoins you know, which are about “we are better than other coins because of this or that, or there is some reason for our existence”, there’s no real reason here. I mean, it’s just like, it’s the internet money.

(07:53) Nik Patel:

I think that’s the reason why it’s still prominent primarily because it isn’t trying to force a reason for its existence.

(08:02) George Manolov:

But so can you, for people like me who haven’t been there since its starts, what is the story of Doge. Is it connected to bitcoin? Is it a fork of bitcoin?

(08:18) Nik Patel:

I think Doge is a fork of Litecoin, but basically it was created towards the end of November, 2013 if I’m right. And it was launched with high supply emission. So the inflation rate was ridiculous. And basically it was all centered around this meme of the Shiba dog as we now see all over Twitter and basically all over the internet. And it picked up traction very quickly because people were still trying to get to grips with understanding the technology and what’s the worst. It still wasn’t that sort of environment where everything was serious and, you know, this is the future and blah, blah, blah. It was people just having fun on the Internet and playing around with the new technology and so then they got a lot of media attention when they sponsored the Jamaican bobsled team, which happened shortly after it was created and launched. And you know, that just catapulted it within the sort of top 10, top 20 altcoins where it now pretty much remains. It’s still in the top 50 coins.

(09:52) George Manolov:

Right. So, okay. And so what’s the reason for people still trading it?

(10:01) Nik Patel:

It has no value, right? It has no utility. So why do people continue to trade it? Well, I think there’s several reasons why. If you think about the longevity effect that people attribute to bitcoin and they say it was the first so that’s why it has the strongest network effect over time. Dogecoin is a very similar case. It was one of the very, very first altcoins, and one that stood the test of time because it wasn’t taking itself seriously. It had no unique use case. It was mainly about the community and what was essentially the function of it was tipping each other for all sorts of things. And so because that community grew very strong in those early years and they stuck around throughout the rest of the cycles over the past five, six years, that longevity effect is still in play and, and there will always be some sort of community around Dogecoin because people have such a fond nostalgic memory of it.

(11:04) George Manolov:

And do people still tip themselves, you know, on Reddit?

(11:08) Nik Patel:

We don’t, I don’t know. I haven’t spent much time on reddit since, you know, 2014, 2015. But I would imagine so, I don’t know why that would have died down because, you know, one Doge is not worth very much because there’s so many. I think it’s a great coin to tip because you can literally give one fifth of a cent to someone and that ends up being, you know, tens of thousands of Doge.

(11:32) George Manolov:

Okay. And so do you yourself still own Doge?

(11:37) Nik Patel:

I don’t at the moment because, you know, for me, most of my holdings are primarily based on a profit potential. And I buy things when they are relatively cheap and I sell them when they are relatively expensive. To me, there’s just no incentive to buy Doge at the moment with so many other greater opportunities in the market. But you know, it’s, I probably should just for nostalgia’s sake, just have some but I don’t know. Not at the moment.

(12:10) George Manolov:

Okay.

(12:11) Nik Patel:

But I think that’s actually another reason why it’s still around because if you look at the price chart for Dogecoin, it’s had more cycles than pretty much any other coin. It’s probably had six bull and bear cycles over the course of the last five and a half years. So it is a staple in the profit incentive model of altcoins. You know, buying at longterm support and selling it longterm resistance is very doable on something like Dogecoin and it continues to be used.

(12:52) George Manolov:

Hey, I just want to take a quick break here. For those of you who haven’t heard of support and resistance as terms, I want to just briefly explain. These are terms which are used when you analyze technically the chart of anything that is being traded essentially on the market. These are two levels when you look at the chart, the resistance level and the support level. So essentially the support level is the base level or one of can be multiple base levels, which the price is expected to hold. Not to get lower than that support level because there’s many buyers who were willing to buy at this price and essentially are preventing the price from getting lower. And the resistance level are people who are selling at a certain level. So it’s kind of hard for the price to break above this certain level, this certain point. So these are very used terms when it comes to analyzing charts. And if you want to get deeper into those, I definitely recommend looking at Nik’s book, or just googling or going on youtube and looking for support and resistance. So you get more visual understanding of those. I think it would be interesting for you to share a little about, you know, the ups and downs in your journey because you know, a lot of people come to this space kind of hearing about the huge returns that one could realize, right? I don’t know like 1000% return, 10000% return on the single investment within very short periods of time. And so you have experienced a lot of that, like you’ve experienced going up, you have experienced going, yeah, maybe like going up again, I don’t know how many times you’ve gone.

(14:58) Nik Patel:

Many, particularly during those first three or four months in 2014 that I got involved in the market. So, just to elaborate on that, I decided I wanted to look at altcoins as a potential investment. I was only 18 at the time, I think, and it was February, March, 2014 and I took 150 pounds of my wages from my part-time job and I put that into, I think it was Vertcoin and Dogecoin to begin with and realize very soon after that I’d missed the cycles and you know, I’d actually bought in after they’d already started to move up. So then I sold out of those and then created an account with an exchange at the time, which was called [inaudible..Mitpal]. And that was the most, you know, prominent, slick, great UI or UX, you know, it was a very professional exchange for the time compared to all of the other crap that we had to deal with. And so yeah I created an account on there and my first ever trade was buying a coin called Masa coin, which I think is now dead and buried. And I bought in on the premise that it was going to be the first cryptocurrency of a native American tribe. So that’s how ridiculous the storylines were back then. I lost, I think it was 75% of my hundred and 50 pounds within a weekend. And so we’re starting from 75% down having to make a four x just to get back to where I was and that was my beginnings. And the thing was at the time that you had, unlike now where the cycle seems to have got longer and longer, even within altcoins, which are fairly dynamic. Back then you would have as you say, 1000% returns within 24 hours, 48 hours, you would have 10000% returns within a week. So things were crazy obviously because liquidity was low, volume was low, market caps for low prices can be pushed around very easily. So there was some crazy rides, crazy roller coasters up, you know, three x in a weekend and making like 7 BTC in a day off my 4 BTC position or whatever it was throughout the summer of 2014. And I basically had to develop a process and actually learn about what I was doing before I became consistently successful. Even though you were able to basically throw a dart at a dart board and come away with something if you weren’t completely inept.

(17:59) George Manolov:

So what were the biggest wins that you’ve had since then? Like percentage wise?

(18:06) Nik Patel:

Percentage wise my biggest whenever was probably, Neutron coin when I returned to the space in the beginning of 2017 I think that was something like 43X, on average with my highest sell being at like 89X or something ridiculous. And then before that, back in 2014, I was in a coin called Piggy coin, which is another meme coin but the developer was well known in the crypto community at the time and he was just, you know, having fun and I decided to buy, because I saw it was quite cheap. And within three or four days, I think I’d done 20X, 30X, I don’t remember the exact figures, but it was a very short span of time to do a ridiculous return on quite a lot of money. So for an 18, 19 year old at the time, it was bizarre.

(19:06) George Manolov:

And so how much of this do you think happened by accident? And how much do you think that, you know, now with your book now with your new approach that’s, and I mean, obviously you have had all this experience, can you replicate this type of success and a similar type of success? And do you think that our listeners can replicate this type of success because this sounds like, you know, something you can’t do.

(19:37) Nik Patel:

So there’s, there’s caveats to this. I would say that no, you can’t, no one can really replicate the returns of say 2014 to 2015 because the market has moved so much since then. And you know, back then a large cap high cap was probably around $3 million. So now that’s barely scratching the surface of a low cap. So as you can imagine, it was far easier to push around prices back then and we were able to make ridiculous returns in a short span of time because of that. Now I still think that altcoins in general present far better opportunities for the general person if they know how to approach them than any other speculative venture, you could go for because there are asymmetric returns. And when you have an understanding of the fundamentals and the technicals that go into your research prior to entering the position, you can skew those greatly so that your risk is not actually that much more than if you were buying, you know, a small cap stocks but your returns are substantially higher. And also for most people, this is the only way. You know, most people don’t have a hundred thousand dollar trading accounts to go into FOREX with, or $1 million account to put into index funds to generate wealth for their families. You know, they have maybe a few hundred dollars or a few thousand dollars at the most. And the only way you can make a serious return on that, without it taking an entire lifetime is to use leverage. Now that is an awful strategy an altcoins present a way to do this without leverage.

(21:29) George Manolov:

Got It. So how has your trading strategy evolved since, since you started? I mean, initially you did a lot of day trading, right? And then you stopped trading for some time and then you returned to it. Have you been day trading since then or what is your approach today?

(21:50) Nik Patel:

My approach today is very much sort of longer term positions. I play for cyclical lows and cyclical highs. So I’m looking at buying in when prices are severely depressed, you know, 90% down from their highs and then I’m waiting out the cycle and then selling when things get relatively expensive again. I do still do some short term trading, but most of that is in traditional financial markets. So you’ll sometimes see me on Twitter posting a chart of say Gold or a currency or another commodity and saying, right so I’m taking a position for the next couple of weeks here thinking that we’re going long or short on gold and that’s the shortest I’ll really do. But now that the markets are starting to turn around in cryptocurrencies in particular I’m actually starting to do a little bit of sort of range playing where currencies that are or altcoins are still within the bear market ranges that have been in play for the past sort of three, four months. And I’m now starting to test those resistance levels. I’m basically swing trading those positions where I’m buying a short term support and selling it short term resistance. Now we can get into that in detail a little later if you want to, but that’s basically how my approach is, but the vast majority is longer term positions.

(23:24) George Manolov:

And how time consuming is this, you know, because can somebody like engage in such type of trading while you know, working on his other job?

(23:35) Nik Patel:

Yes, so this is exactly one of the reasons why I’ve shifted towards longer term positions for the bulk of my speculative positions. And it’s because it requires far less intensive effort. The problem with day trading, even though it’s highly glamorized is that you do have to be for the most part in front of your screens most of the day. And that’s not really something… I didn’t enjoy it. I didn’t enjoy just having to sit in front of my computer all the time. That’s not really, that doesn’t fit my personality type. I like to be doing things. So I then shifted away into longer and longer term positions, which only require, you know, you can take a weekend of doing some research and then you’re kind of set for a cycle because you’ve done your research for that, for that next six months and you know, you’re looking at, okay, so stricly fee speaking, we can buy here and then we’ll wait until prices start to move back up again in our favor. And that’s basically as much effort as you have to put in. Now the problem is you do have to have that, a general understanding of what you’re looking for, which does take you know, hours and some intense research to begin with. And then you do have to have those periods where you can just devote maybe six hours a day for a couple of days to get in that backlog of research done to begin with. But it does alleviate the problems of having to constantly be in front of a screen.

(25:12) George Manolov:

Okay. And here comes my other question. I’ve been thinking, so let’s say our listeners or some of them decide to opt in for such type of waiting where they enter in longterm positions, they have another job or they have other stuff they want to do. It’s like they don’t want, you know, to obsess their lives 100% about crypto. They think it’s a big opportunity, but they don’t want to obsess about it. Isn’t then there are threats or isn’t there a opportunity or the chance that they actually miss selling at the right time because you know they are not in front of the screen.

(25:58) Nik Patel:

Well this is the compromise you have to make between security and convenience. Because for me, I don’t store anything on exchanges so I’m always going to miss my targets by some degree or other because prices moved away. Even if it’s only by a percent or two by the time I have transferred my funds to an exchange. So for me that’s an ongoing problem, but it’s one that I’m happy to take. For other people they might think, well actually it makes more sense to me,because I’m only putting in a little bit of money and I don’t really want to have to think about it. Maybe it does make more sense to me to just kind of buy a couple of altcoins, set my targets, set my sell orders and just leave it be. And you know, if you’re comfortable with having your funds on an exchange that makes the process very easy for you.

(26:53)George Manolov:

And why aren’t you keeping your funds at an exchange?

(26:58) Nik Patel:

Because you don’t own your coins if they’re on an exchange, the exchange opens and you’re basically at their mercy, if they decide to lock you out your account for some reason or they get hacked or exit scam or something like that, then you no longer have access to your funds.

(27:16) George Manolov:

And that’s certainly valid for many exchanges. But what about like the most reputable ones? Binance for example.

(27:28) Nik Patel:

Even more than Binance – I think Bittrex has the best reputation for security. it’s been around for literally since I have been around, so five and a half, six years, never once been hacked, never once had any issues with transparency or anything like that. It’s regulated. It’s in the US, so it’s a US based exchange. They comply with everything they have to. So I mean if I was going to leave funds on an exchange, that would be the only one.

(28:02) George Manolov:

Okay. All right.

(28:07) Nik Patel:

But obviously people have their own preferences, don’t they. So they might be used to trading on Binance and completely trusting, in which case they’re quite happy to leave. Even if it’s not in their entire portfolio, they’re happy to leave a significant chunk on there because they don’t feel like they need to worry. And that’s a personal choice and it does provide convenience, particularly for those who can’t, you know, this isn’t their full time job and they need to be thinking about other things for most of the day. It does make sense for them to be able to store their funds on an exchange.

(28:45) George Manolov:

Okay. Got It. And so before we jump more deeper into like your actual methodology of how you look into, what type of clients you look into and how you look into them for trading, I’d be curious to learn a little more about how your outlook on the general market has evolved because in addition to the different types of content that you share, you also talk a lot about the market. Around Bitcoin as obviously the biggest coin and the one that is in many cases driving the market, if not in all cases. So where do you see ourselves currently? Like what’s your outlook? We’ve been down a lot now we have come at a place where, you know, more or less the market, is stable of Bitcoin we even had a small altcoin, season, so to say. So a lot of the altcoins did see some growth in the recent weeks. Do you think that there is still an opportunity for Crypto to go significantly down? You know, at some point there were a lot of talks of Bitcoin going down to below three thousands, even below 2000. And then when there was this reverse, so everyone was like, oh my God, Bitcoin is going to 5,000, you know.

(30:22) Nik Patel:

People’s memories are very short term and they have a recency bias. So they will look at the past on their 15 minute charts, they will look at the past two days worth of data and they’ll determine an opinion about where the entire market is going off that two days of data. And you see it all the time on Twitter. You see bitcoin go down 1.2% on the day and all of a sudden we’re going down to 1.4K and then it goes up 1.2%, and you’re like, oh my God, we’re going for new all time highs. It’s quite silly, but it’s just the way, I mean, I don’t begrudge people for doing that. That’s just how they have been taught or how they’ve looked at the markets for the past, however long and haven’t developed a new approach. But I actually composed this thread on Twitter quite recently, which I would, you know, ask people to go and have a look at. It’s on my Twitter feed and it’s quite prominent. That’s a series of about 15, 16 tweets basically answering this question. But I will go through it now. But perhaps not as eloquently.

(31:32) George Manolov:

You can find the link to this threat that Nik is talking about in the show notes. Now, please note that this thread as well as the analysis that Nik is going to share here on the podcast just in a bit were done a bit before the recent price jump in bitcoin. So while on first sight, they might not look as totally relevant. I definitely urge you to listen very carefully to what he has to say, because when you take into consideration the fact that crypto markets repeat themselves a lot there’s a lot you can learn from the type of arguments and thoughts he shares which will definitely help you look into the markets in a more thoughtful way now and in the future as well.

(32:24) Nik Patel:

So I think that you know, you can’t rule out anything in the space and there is certainly the possibility that we do have further significant downside to see. If I was putting on my, I would say that the low would be around 2,400 to $2,500. I don’t think we’ll go below that. And if we do, I think it will be for a very, very brief period of time that will be immediately brought up. But I think if we do end up having some sort of bearish continuation over the next couple of months, I think it would be towards that $2,500 level. Just to basically take out the loans we’ve recently made and then reverse from there and form some sort of consolidation area. Now that’s not actually what I think is going to happen. I think the worst is pretty much done and dusted. I’ll go out on a limb and say that. I think that the market as a whole has found its bottom and that we will go and retest it. Potentially towards the end of Q2, the beginning of Q3 this year. I think that we will go and test that again but I think before that we’re going to see what we have. What we’re seeing right now in altcoins is basically just shake out moves. These are, you can look through charts from the past six years and you will see that what proceeds alt seasons. So called alt seasons is these mini waves that come to shake people out before the actual moves begin. Now for most altcoins, this is the longest period of accumulation or consolidation in their entire histories. There are coins like Monero which have been in a stable range for three and a half months now. That is the longest time that has been range bound in its history. There are coins like Ark and Komodo, which have been in ranges for about six months, which is just absurd. I’ve never seen ranges that long before. Now the longer a range, the likelihood of there being a much higher price is very strong because they’ve had so much more time to accumulate and control a portion of the supply that manipulating prices becomes far easier. And so for me, I’m thinking that what we’re going to see is perhaps another couple of weeks of consolidation in the altcoin market in general, and then we’ll start to see things move significantly higher. And then what I expect to happen with Bitcoin is it remains largely range bound. We are currently in a period bouncing between 3,300 and 4,400. Those are the range low and the range high that had been set for the past few months. And I think we’ll continue to stay within that range for the most part, for the next two months, I would say. And across that two months is when we’ll see these altcoin movements take place. Now alts move very dynamically. So two months is all they need to play out their entire bull cycle. You’ve seen it before – in January 2018 we had four weeks of altcoins moving and they went astronomical and then we have had a 15 month period of respite. So it doesn’t take very long to push things up. And I think during this period of bitcoin consolidation and range play is when we’ll see, altcoins start to move up significantly higher and have some sort of bull cycle of their own. Now then what I think will disrupt that is when bitcoin breaks out of this range and I think it will be to the upside to begin with. And what we’ll have is a move towards that six k resistance or support now turned resistant. And I think what we see is a hard rejection from that level on the first test, which will completely shake up the market and altcoins will peak out and start to come all the way back down towards these ranges that have formed over the past three, four, five months. Now, bitcoin will also come down back into its range and potentially take out the 3,300 low and everything will start to look very dismal again. I don’t actually think we’ll break that low, but I think we’ll form some sort of double bottom around that area. And from that point in, I estimate to be sort of late Q three of this year, then the market will begin its macro bull cycle, you know, against the dollar. So we’ll start to see a movement upwards both in altcoin versus USD and bitcoin itself. And that’s when I think, you know, towards the end of the year is when we’ll actually start to come out of this bear market.

(37:33) George Manolov:

So what makes you draw this analysis? What makes you say that? Because you know that sounds great. But the question is like, how do you come up with this type of predictions. What do you base them on?

(37:49) Nik Patel:

So if I’m thinking in the… as I’ve said, I outlined my thoughts more clearly in that thread. But if I’m thinking as someone who is looking to manipulate prices to turn a profit, then this is the single best time to do so in altcoins since 2014. Now, for most people who’ve only been here since 2017, they’ve seen a inverse relationship between.

(38:15) George Manolov:

Just one sec before I let you in. So sure, you said if someone is willing to manipulate prices. So basically you’re saying that there’s, you know, the big players, the big whales and so to say are always on the lookout and there’s like these type of intervals where they drive the whole market down

(38:36) Nik Patel:

And then they accumulate at cheap, and then they drive the market up and they sell when things get expensive. So that’s what people basically need to do. It’s you know, you don’t even need to read the book. You basically just need to buy when things are cheap and sell when they’re expensive. Now of course, it’s much more difficult than that in practice, but that’s exactly what I am mapping the behavior of in these market movers and whales, and price manipulators. So the reason that I have this outlook for the rest of the year is that bitcoin is now priced or has been priced over the past sort of four months, particularly when it was towards 3300 to $3500, at the same prices from Q two, Q three 2017. So it’s been about two years since we’ve had prices around these levels, in bitcoin. Now altcoins versus USD in January, 2018 went to ridiculous levels, but people weren’t paying attention to altcoin USD – people like myself because we were so, you know, we’ve been in the space, for the past five, six years and we are primarily tuned towards looking at altcoins verse BTC. Because that’s what you trade, but because bitcoin was getting expensive, it was going from $3,000 to $20,000 in a space of about six months. We hadn’t thought: “actually we need to be looking at altcoins versus USD” because these prices are what are going to ridiculous levels. And when we were looking at altcoins versus BTC, they weren’t really moving that much higher. And so many of us who were setting our targets based on, you know, Litecoin vs Bitcoin or Stratcoin vs Bitcoin, we were actually thinking of why is the market starting to turn around in the first, second week of January, 2018 when it hasn’t actually hit any of these levels against bitcoin. Now it’s only when you then look at old altcoins vs USD that you see how ridiculous things got. And the whole market went from I think it was like $10 billion for the crypto market cap in January or February of 2017 to 840 billion just 12 months later. Now, that’s crazy. So what we should have been looking at is that correlation between alts and USD. Now for people who have only been in the space since 2017, all they’ve seen is this inverse relationship between bitcoin and altcoint. So you saw bitcoin go mostly ridiculous towards the end of the year in 2017 and then bitcoin topped out and alt started moving up against it. And before that, when bitcoin was moving up in sort of May towards December, 2017, altcoins were actually declining in price, right? So for most people they look at it and they think, well, there’s an inverse relationship here and it’s yet to really be broken. But if you go back to 2014, 2015, there was actually a direct relationship between the two, there was an inverse relationship between the two, there was a combination of those. There has never really been just one true relationship between bitcoin price and altcoin prices. So for me, I’m looking at this and if I’m trying to adapt the mindset of a market manipulator who can turn the most profit in the shortest period of time and align themselves best with the market, I would say that: right we’ve got the cheapest Bitcoin we’ve had in two years, so altcoin, USD prices are also depressed as well as altcoin BTC prices. We’ve seen minus 90% on altcoin/BTC, let alone altcoins versus USD. So this is the cheapest time to accumulate alts in, you know, over two years now nearly. So it makes complete sense to run these up whilst bitcoin remains range bound at this cheap price. Cheap bitcoin is then facilitating greater moves in altcoins. Now if you get greater moves in altcoins, you accumulate more whilst BTC is still cheap, which means that when the bitcoin market turns around, you have more to profit with against the dollar because bitcoin breaks out of the range or breaks out of its bear market, its macro bear market for the long term. And because you’ve had this altcoin cycle, you’ve accumulated far more bitcoin.

(43:31) George Manolov:

Okay. And then like if you’re saying, okay, based on past movements, based on past patterns that you’re looking, you’re expecting that there will be an altcoin season because you know, manipulators, big crypto holders, this is like basically the perfect conditions for them to realize significant profits

(43:55) Nik Patel:

And a very unique scenario because it doesn’t come around often where, you have bitcoin at relatively cheap prices, altcoins at relatively cheap prices against USD and against bitcoin.

(44:11) George Manolov:

Okay. Then what makes you… you say manipulators drive the altcoin market. Do they also drive the bitcoin market or what, what do you think? What’s your reason why bitcoin would eventually come back significantly bullish?

(44:29) Nik Patel:

So I think there’s a combination. I mean it’s quite a nuanced discussion. Obviously this is not just market manipulators moving everything or there’s not just some puppet master pulls a string on everything but in altcoins which are largely deregulated, which don’t require leverage to trade, which you can control a significant portion of the supply on there is absolutely a manipulation because it’s the easiest way to turn a profit. And whilst there is a profit incentive, this will continue to go on, in bitcoin it’s much more difficult because it’s such a larger market, but I do still think it occurs along with the general sentiment of the public as well as fundamentals. I think it’s much more complicated with the price of bitcoin. But with altcoins in particular, you can map this out by using the transparency of the blockchain. You can look at rich lists on altcoins, map that against the chart and you can see: “oh look on this day there was a massive volume spike”. So lots of this coin was traded. Then you look at the top 20 holders, map back to that day and all of a sudden you see, actually they accumulated on this day. So you can literally see people controlling, cornering supply over time.

(45:55) George Manolov:

Okay. So maybe we can use this points that you’re mentioning here to kind of transition to the part where you talk more about specifically what type of assets you’re trading and how do you select to trade them. Because you have like already entered into in this field. I guess we can just go through your general approach and methodology, but maybe you can start by defining like what are the altcoins you’re trading? Are you looking at the big altcoins when it comes to market capitalization. So you know, the sort of say together, the cumulative of price of all market coins are looking at small ones are looking at mid ones.

(46:41) Nik Patel:

So for me, none of that makes any difference. What I’m looking for is assets that are cheap and assets that are expensive and that is relative to their price histories because that’s all we really have to go on with altcoins. And there’s no real sort of fundamental valuation models that have been developed to any degree in altcoins at the moment. It’s not like you can do some sort of a equity research akin to having a Benjamin Graham valuation model. It doesn’t really work like that with alts. So what we actually have to tell whether they’re overpriced or underpriced is just their price. So that’s what I tend to look at and for the most part before 2018 I was looking at micro caps, low caps or microcaps of coins under a $10 million market cap in general. And this was because I felt that the vast majority of the large caps and the mid caps were severely overpriced and inflated.

(47:49) George Manolov:

When Nik talks about micro caps, small caps and large caps, he’s referring to the market capitalization of a certain altcoin, of a certain coin. So essentially you can go the best place and the most popular place where all crypto enthusiast go is coinmarketcap.com where you can see a list of all coins which are currently being traded and their market capitalization, which basically I guess the closest thing you can say that defines this is a valuation of the coin. So this is basically the amount of coins which are out there in circulation multiplied by the price of a single coin. And there you have the market cap or essentially the price of all coins which are out there on the market.

(48:40) Nik Patel:

Now because we’ve experienced a minus 90% nearly in altcoin USD prices across the board, I actually don’t think there’s any reason to look at the smaller projects where there is significant higher fundamental risks. I actually think that, you know, you can look at something like a strategist, which is down 95% against Bitcoin, I think not even against dollars. And you can see similar speculative opportunities with equally high reward to risk without having to venture into smaller altcoins. So for me right now, I’m primarily looking at mid caps and large caps just because they are so severely depressed as the rest of the market and they finally look attractive.

(49:29) George Manolov:

Okay, understood. Then again, you know, because you’re saying now it’s the right time to buy now is a good time to buy there’s good price action indicators. But if some of our listeners wants to do this, like you’re saying now is the time and they want to try it out. What is the methodology that you would advise such people to follow? Because I mean, probably just going there and buying is not the smartest thing to do. And then maybe not.

(50:13) Nik Patel:

It could play out in the same way that me and early 2014 was managing to hit winners with no skill whatsoever and no research process. I was literally just looking at what people were talking about on Twitter and I would then buy based off that. And I was looking at what smarter traders than me where doing and I would just copy them. But that is definitely not a long-term approach. And so back then I had to develop my knowledge and my skillset during that summer of 2014 all the way through until now when I’m still learning. But I think, you know, if I was beginning again and I was working a full time job outside of the crypto space and I just wanted to put some money in and hopefully net a greater return than I would if I was putting it elsewhere in any other asset class. Then for me, I’m thinking the easiest thing to do is probably just look at the sort of top 30 and then all you would really be doing is looking at the charts and looking at the longterm all time price charts. And then from there, all you’re looking at…

(51:30) George Manolov:

Let’s just make it very simple for everybody who has a little or not too much experience. So you go on coin market cap and you look at coinmarketcap.com and you look at the top 30 coins there.

(51:49) Nik Patel:

I mean you could extend that or restrict that to your whim. But really what I’m trying to say is you don’t really need to venture into a sort of mid cap, low cap space where you do have to do much more research. Really all you’re looking for is projects that have been in the space for some time and that are attractively priced because there are, as we were speaking about stuff like Dogecoin, which whilst you may not think it has any utility, has proved over the past six years that it’s here to stay. And it’s has so many cycles that it actually shows you what’s an attractive price and what’s an unattractive price more clearly than many other coins. So let’s take that for an example. You would look at the Dogecoin chart on coin market cap and all you are looking for is: is price attractive or not? And the way to determine that is whether it’s at the lows or whether it’s at the highs. If it’s somewhere in the middle, then it’s unclear, then that’s useless. All you’re looking for is coins that are priced at their historical lows. That’s it. And those projects are the ones you would put a little bit of money into. I always stress for people who are new to the space. The main thing that you need to do is make sure you’re not putting in money that’s not disposable because that sets the game against you immediately. And you have to overcome many more psychological hurdles when you’re investing or speculating with money that you need to pay bills or that is intrinsic to your daily life. So for me, the primary thing is just to go: right this is say $1,000, a thousand pounds, a thousand euros, whatever it is just pretend you’re buying a really nice bike and a few pairs of shoes. That’s how you have to look at it as though it’s sunk money that you don’t need to worry about again. And using that by maybe three to five of these severely depressed altcoins that have been around for a while and a price that historical lows and that’s the easiest way to do it. I would say obviously if you want to take a more active approach, that’s where that’s a returns come. But I think that that simplistic process over the next, you know, two to five years will return significantly better rewards than many other asset classes.

(54:21) George Manolov:

So simply you buy at the lows, looking at the graphs at the top, at the very low costs or at close to lows. And then on and off, you’re either looking at the charts or you simply set orders to sell when prices have reached certain higher levels.

(54:43) Nik Patel:

Yeah. So, you’re literally just looking at the history of prices. That’s it. It’s very clear cut. You’re looking at when has price become expensive in history and when has it become cheap? So that is all you really need to go off. It’s obviously very difficult to articulate this without some sort of visual aids but I think if people do, you know it’s, particularly people who have no real familiarity with charts and what math they do, just go on to a TradingView or coinmarketcap or any of those websites where you can look at charts and just have a look through. No indicators, no nothing, just look through at price over the course of the entire history of the coin. And you’ll spot intuitively what looks expensive and what looks cheap.

(55:34) George Manolov:

Just want to take a quick break here in order for you to clearly understand what Nik’s means as a good level to buy and a good level to sell. You should go and check his blog posts, the precedence of price. I have linked it in the show notes below, but you can just Google “the precedence of price Nik Patel” and you will find his blog post where he visually goes through several charts, including the Dogecoin chart. And he explains in detail what is a good time to sell what is a good time to buy. And I’m sure you’ll really get the hang of it the moment you look at it, it’s quite simple. So go and check that out. Okay. So that’s the lead, the approach, which takes the least amount of time from somebody who doesn’t have too much time to spend on this. And at the same time relatively confidently can generate you a nice type of return for a short time. And then what about people who really want to, you know, getting deeper into this because in your book and in your existing content creation for your blog and for your email subscribers, you get into depth into how you look at way more coins, how you go through the whole coin market capitalists and you narrow down the ones which you believe have really big potential. So let’s say we are really aiming for something significant. We really want to become very good at this, not just, you know, for as a side thing? What would be then your, what is your methodology so to say?

(57:30) Nik Patel:

Obviously it’s quite difficult to break it down sort of completely step by step because we’d be here for hours. But just to summarize, my approach is based on first filtering coins, using various metrics and filters. You know, I provide for free on, on the website and in the blog and on Twitter and stuff, you can actually have a look and see what I’m looking at. But what I’m doing is taking the 2,500 coins on coin market cap, let’s say, and I’m whittling them down to a list of usually around 50 based on these metrics many of which are to do with, you know, market cap volume or average volume across the past 30 days. The relationship between its market cap and its volume, volatility, lots of different things as I think there’s like 21 things I put in that document that I provided for free or 23 things. But those are the filters that I use to whittle that list down as far as possible. And then when I have a list of say 30 to 50 coins, that all adhere, not strictly, but generally to these principles, that’s when I do my fundamental research where I’m looking at the community of the coin. It’s development all possible aspects. You know I’m basically doing a deep dive on these coins to figure out whether I think there is a serious risks here of the team running away, whether there is nothing really being worked on. It doesn’t have to be anything unique, but there has to be some development going on. And whether there is a community that’s engaged or not, because if there’s no community, then there’s a high chance of that coin is going to die out. So that’s what I’m looking for with my fundamental research. And then I conclude with a technical overview, which gives me my entries, my exits. I’m looking for, as I say, it’s the same sort of process where I’m looking for cheap prices. I don’t buy things at all time highs. I don’t buy things even 30, 40, 50% of all time highs. I liked them to be severely depressed before I buy them. I’m looking for accumulation ranges, which are basically just periods where prices stayed within a tight range for a prolonged period of time. Usually at historical lows. And that’s pretty much it. And I try and keep it as simple as possible when it comes to actual entries and exits and stuff like that. And I do just take the time, test it, value investing approach, let’s say, but just apply it to cryptocurrencies and just look for what is cheap and what is expensive.

(01:00:30) George Manolov:

Okay. Yeah. And I feel like I want to share my opinion here as well because from my point of perspective, I’ve been in the crypto space for a while. I’ve never really traded actively. I’ve always been kind of in the space, so to say out of very significant intellectual curiosity out or the real belief in the long term potential of crypto. And then I myself, like never considered myself the type of guy who’s like into trading because that’s not something I feel is my biggest strength. I focus more on being part of projects in the crypto space and trying to build stuff. So I have a general understanding of you know, terminology and how things work. I have obviously, you know, I mean I’m a human right, so I have bought some coins, I have sold some coins.

(01:01:33) Nik Patel:

And experience the emotional cycle.

(01:01:35) George Manolov:

Right, so I can say that from my humble experience, most of the trades I’ve done, have been negative.

(01:01:43) Nik Patel:

Okay. Right. It’s the way it is.

(01:01:48) George Manolov:

But after I read through, through your book, you know, I just like look at coins and any coin I look out there, from a totally different perspective. And it’s not like what you’re explaining there is rocket science. I mean, it’s very intuitive. Most of the stuff is really, I would say even basic. I mean, it’s like you don’t have to be a phd or something to understand it. It’s just that you, didn’t really realize this much or you didn’t spend, or you didn’t thought of: “hey, I can use this tool in this really smart way.” Which can give me an indication that this is actually a strong project or this project has the potential to generate a significant return. So just wanted to give my 2 cents, so to say, for the audience and for anyone who has the time and who decides that this is something he or she wants to get into that I think it’s totally worth going through Nik’s materials on his blog and particularly the book which, which goes, from start till end and and walks through all the things in great detail and in a very simple kind of logic to follow.

(01:03:07) Nik Patel:

Yeah. And I think there’s a couple of things I want to add there. Firstly people… I don’t know why, but people do tend to equate complexity with proficiency when that’s not ever the case. Usually when you complicate something, it becomes much less effective rather than more effective. And also the tools are all there. You know that it’s one of the wonderful things about blockchain technology is that much of it is transparent and so you can see things that you can’t see if you are looking at equities or commodities. So this asset class in particular you can map out a lot of this stuff that would guide you to making the right decisions. And that’s all I try and run through in the book and in the blog and on Twitter. It’s just reframing things from a very simple, basic perspective but just showing it doesn’t have to be difficult or complicated. And the hardest thing by far is the psychological rollercoaster and just being able to control your emotions. And that’s something no one can teach you that is through sheer experience and some people might not even have that in them.

(01:04:21) George Manolov:

Right, right. It’s about really developing self-discipline. So the book, on the one hand it’s a really fun read because it shares your personal roller coaster in this field. On the other hand, it provides your methodology into looking at a low cap and medium cap coins out there. But then you have the blog. So what is the, what is the role of the blog because I mean I read the book, you wrote it, I think it was last year or…

(01:05:02) Nik Patel:

Yeah, it was published in June 20 June, 2017, 28. Yeah. Wait, no, June 2018.

(01:05:09) George Manolov:

Okay, got it. Yeah. So, the space is evolving very fast as you, as you yourself said all the time. So, while most of the information there is like, or all of the information there is still very applicable, there’s new stuff to be added all the time.

(01:05:25) Nik Patel:

As you said, the role of the blog is to act as a ongoing supplementary resource for those who read the book. Not even those who read the book, but for people who do want to understand how things are developing regarding analysis and research in the space for speculative purposes and I think that whilst the book, you know, the first half is a memoir and the second half is a manual and I will be revising it at some point to update on the past 12, 15 months. I actually think that you don’t even need to really read the book. You just need to maybe look at the material of the free material on the blog and because my approach has developed so much, you can see on the blog where I’m at right now. And yeah, I think mainly I’ve just gone much more deeply into my fundamental research and coming up with various new ways to value something and determine whether there’s interest in it.

(01:06:35) George Manolov:

Right. And so the very curious thing to me and I think potentially very valuable for our listeners is the fact that basically the whole methodology that you share in your book and which you have obviously developed over time, it takes a lot of time to actually do it yourself and start from all altcoins on coin market cap. It’s not rocket science but you need to put in the work, right? Yeah. It’s labor intensive. And so for certain coins, you do this and you share it in a very easy to read, I would say even eye candy, infographic type of approach, which anyone can just go and open and see and basically, you go through all these metrics and you say: Hey, this is how this coin scores on this, on that type of metric. And then you put the general, like a big score as to whether this coin is worth to be bought or to be sold. Now, my thought when we’re looking at this on the one hand was like, this is really cool. I mean, I don’t have to put in the work. I mean, I can just go and see Nik’s thoughts and then if he says it’s worth to buy, I go and buy it. If it’s not, it’s, it’s not. So, like you think that’s something that, that people can do and should do. Would you advice people to?

(01:08:12) Nik Patel:

See the problem there, I mean, people are free to do whatever they decide to do. Right. And I stress at the beginning of the reports and stuff that I published on the website. And then I also then, as you say, turned them into infographics that I email out. And I stress that it’s not even just about the speculative possibility. I’m looking at the fundamental quality, the technical quality and then also, bringing in that speculative perspective. So the grading is actually all encompassing. Whether the project is fundamentally good, fundamentally sound. Whether it is attractively priced and whether there is a high reward to risk opportunity there. So there’s a lot that goes into that. But as I say, people are free to do whatever they want, but the problem you run into when you do just run with someone else’s ideas and not putting the work yourself is you come back to that problem of market psychology. When you haven’t done the work yourself, it’s very easy to find yourself manipulated and you become very anxious when price moves against you because you haven’t done the work yourself. So you don’t know whether it’s actually sound. Even though you might respect the author of the work. So for me, I have no issues when I buy based off my own research because I’ve put in the hours to look at all of these various different aspects and I know that my research is sound. Whereas if I’m coming as a new reader and I’m like: “right, so this person who’s fairly well known in the space or has been around for awhile, has written this in depth report and says, so and so shall I buy this?” And then you buy it and then all of a sudden prices go the other way. It’s very easy for you to be shaken out, let’s say and then price turns around or for you to think: “oh, well, his research was flawed, why did I follow that?” So there’s so many different variables there and I don’t think anyone should ever just go on the word of somebody else when making a financial decision at all. If they choose to do so, that’s their problem really. But for me, it is there as a guide for people to then do their own research from.

(01:10:41) George Manolov:

Okay. All right. And then let’s go on the speculative path that, imagine that… I mean, you already have a very significant traction and a meaningful following. I’m sure that some amount of people follow your trades and now that you’re publishing these reports on an ongoing basis, I wouldn’t, you know… I will totally imagine a point at which you could start having such an audience and such a track record that the moment you publish your report, let’s say a lot of your followers just go and follow whatever you share as an opinion like, right?

(01:11:30) Nik Patel:

The thing is, it already happens on Twitter. If I shared a chart or you know, several other people share charts of coins that are, you know, probably outside of the top 100, they move the price. And it’s one of those situations where you’re like, well, what do I do? Do I just refrain from providing any information, or do I just suck it up and think that there’s always going to be people who just latch onto something and then they get burned and then they won’t do it again? But with the blog, I think you’re right in saying that it could get to a stage where people do just jump on. I mean, I make it very clear in the reports that I’m not providing any actual trades. I don’t say whether I vented a position at any particular point or what I’m looking for. I just say, right, this is priced attractively and you know, this would be risk reward if this was to occur. But for me, I don’t think most people actually act on the information that they see. So, if you look across any domain, any space, any branch of knowledge or content that someone is providing, and you see that they’ve accrued some sort of vast following, the majority of those people, even if they’re spending time consuming that information, don’t actually put it into practice. And if they do, some of those people put it into practicing incorrectly.

(01:13:04) George Manolov:

Right. Yeah. That’s, that’s so true. Nowadays it is.

(01:13:10) Nik Patel:

You know, it happens. Well, I do it myself. You know, I’ll be watching something on a digital marketing or this or that, and then all of a sudden I’m like, well, I’ve just spent two hours watching that, but I haven’t done anything to put it into practice.

(01:13:25) George Manolov:

Right. No, that’s totally true. It’s like on the one hand, we live in this amazing time where Information is everywhere and also you have access to super high quality information from literally free. For free. Just a click away. And nevertheless, you know, a lot of the stuff is common sense. You know, it works, it’s proven it works, but people still don’t do it. Yeah. And you know, that’s a much deeper problem than I am going to be able to solve.

(01:14:01) George Manolov:

Overall, I’m super bullish on bitcoin. I’ve listened to several of the talks of MustStopMurad, Murad Mahmudov. He’s like the big super maximalist on bitcoin. But I’ve been thinking like this can really be so revolutionary and at the same time it’s still so small on a global scale. And so there is potentially the scenario where there’s big bankers, there’s people with so much capital which understand that this is a real threat. And what they can do, they can buy in and control it, right. But they can buy a lot, you know, over the counter continuously during accumulation times and then at some point decide to just start dumping the hell out of it so price goes so low that people lose confidence.

(01:15:14) Nik Patel:

The issue with that is, you know, as we spoke about in the podcast itself, the network effect, the longevity of Bitcoin, it means that there are always on a daily basis, there’s a growing number of people who intrinsically fundamentally believe in the technology and those OTC sellers will dry up at various price levels and then you just have to buy higher, even if you’re buying on the market or off the market. There is only a certain amount of people who are going to sell it at a certain price. And particularly those who hold the vast majority of Bitcoin, they’re not, they’re definitely not going to sell their bitcoin at 3000, 4,000, $5,000. So you know, if big banks want to eventually in the long term destroy bitcoin, they’re going to have to push it up far higher before they’re able to do so. Because they’re going to have to, they’re going to have to control enough of the supply to be able to crush it. And to do that, they’re going to have to buy off the biggest holders currently.

(01:16:21) George Manolov:

And they are not selling, right.

(01:16:22) Nik Patel:

And they are not selling.

(01:16:24) George Manolov:

All right Nik. So I think this has been really valuable, for me and I believe for our listeners. Before I end this talk. I have a couple of questions to you, which I always ask, you know, people who are here on the show and the first one, you know, your case is particular, but I try to pay tribute to evangelists of the crypto space because I’m myself a believer in Crypto, in its design and its future. And for me, you know, there was this moment and for many people there’s this moment when they realize crypto, blockchain, bitcoin is going to be huge like this clicking in your head. Oh my God, this is like really revolutionary. Was there such a point within your life and if so, what was it that that brought it up? Was it something you read something that…

(01:17:29) Nik Patel:

There was probably two points. The first point was that initial interaction with Dogecoin and the tipping phenomenon back in late 2013, early 2014 where I was thinking this is just absurd. I’m being sent money, or what is essentially money by someone completely random across the internet who I don’t even know where they are, and they can send it to me instantly and I have my own wallet that I control. And it was just that sort of intuitive feeling of wow, whilst this is kind of a joke in terms of its context, the underlying technology just feels revolutionary and very valid for the future. So there was that point definitely, but I was, you know, I was still only 18 at the time and I wasn’t really paying that much attention, so that sort of lingered, but it didn’t really grab me very much. The second moment that I hard was listening to Andreas Antonopoulos, speak and it wasn’t live or anything like that. I think it was just a youtube video of one of his speeches and that might have been towards the end of 2014. And I was like, wow, this guy has completely encapsulated, distilled these ideas so perfectly. And it really put a light bulb in my head like, wow, he’s seeing the future in a way different to most people that will communicate to get back then.

(01:19:10) George Manolov:

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, Andreas is somebody that I think almost anyone who is in crypto…

(01:19:20) Nik Patel:

They owe him something.

(01:19:21) George Manolov:

Right. Totally. But great I mean it’s very interesting that in your case, you first experienced it, you know, and then you…

(01:19:31) Nik Patel:

Then have it articulated.

(01:19:33) George Manolov:

Yeah. Right, right. Okay, awesome. Then again, a heads up for, Andreas and then ever since then, you’ve grown a lot. You’ve developed, you’ve obviously had the successes in the industry. You’ve increased your understanding at this point in time where you have in essence turned yourself into sort of an influence or person who is a kind of enriching the space. Who is a person or a couple people that you’re currently looking up to or people that you are learning from, whether that’s with regards to trading or whether that’s with regards to the crypto space in general, who’s somebody that you follow, you know, people follow you, but I’m sure you also follow other people.

(01:20:23) Nik Patel:

Right. So, there’s quite a few to be fair. But I would say if I had to pick one or two, one of the main people that I still look towards and still speak to when I need clarification on things and he just has a far broader understanding of all of this than I do is not so fast on Twitter @not so fast. And he is predominantly a minor, but he’s been in the space since even before me and was one of the first people at the time who I interacted with. He is a fountain of all knowledge when it comes to crypto currencies in general. He can speak about all possible topics at length. So that’s definitely someone that I still look at. But a second person. It’s hard to say because I don’t want to leave anyone out. And there’s a lot of people that I would want to mention. No, I think I’ll just leave that at not so fast because I think he encompasses most of the other aspects of other people anyway.

(01:21:40) George Manolov:

Good. Notsofast is good enough. I’m definitely gonna check him out. Okay. Awesome then it was great having you. Before we let it go, where can our listeners learn more about you, follow you, and look at your new work?

(01:22:03) Nik Patel:

Sure. So, you can find me on Twitter, which is at @cointraderNik, N-i-k . You can find my free material on the blog, which is www.altaltcointradershandbook.com. And that’s also the title of the book. It’s a bit of a mouthful, but yeah those are the two main places.

(01:22:27) George Manolov:

Awesome. Nik. It was a pleasure having this talk and maybe we can do it sometime in the future again.

(01:22:34) Nik Patel:

Yeah, definitely. Thank you for having me. It was a great conversation.

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